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Topic: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
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zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 8:50 PM

With premeditated player targeting. a book could be written about it, in my opinion its a art form fully understood by very few.


i updated my last post with a visual prediction for game 4


and in game 6 here is my move;

1)K10,N10
2)L7,

Rollie to move...


Message was edited by: zoeyk at May 5, 2010 2:52 PM

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zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 9:06 PM

in my opinion the clump of stones you did, did work. maybe not for a sure win, however, white was forced to be very careful of the 3rd move, many 3rds could had lost, it was not intuitive, and further more, in the game we did, you'll notice white was forced to engage the distant formation, ignoring it was instant death. so you might find that interesting as i do.

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zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 9:16 PM

for a brief look at premeditated player targeting, and this is just the tip of the ice burg, these are a few from nosovs book he wrote,

When you are preparing for a specific game it is reasonable to analyze the opponent's
game according to the following scheme:

1. Analyze how your opponent plays when he meets a novelty.
2. Look whether he gets into time-troubles.
3. Look which openings were used and his results in these openings.
4. Pay special attention to the games of the recent period.
5. Find out which color who is better for him.

6. Analyze such things
a) quality of his play in better, equal and bad situations;
b) quality of his play in situations of various essence (double-edged, defensive,
passive);
c) ability to invent original strategically and tactical ideas.

7. Analyze opponent's behavior in typical situations appearing in tournaments:
a) "all or nothing" - both players need a victory;
b) situation of a compromise;
c) the result has no significance;
d) influence of lack of success;
e) efficiency of playing with opponents of various standards.

8) influence of quantity of games during playing day.

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rollietesh

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Age: 51
Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 10:01 PM

zoeyk,

That's a nice break-down of possible preparation 'hopes' for P2.

#3 is 90% of it. Finding a flaw in a P1 opponent's previous game(s) and hoping that they repeat the error is perhaps the only reliable way to try and win as P2. This has the best chance of success if the opponent won their previous game, despite the mistake. This makes them more likely to repeat it.

#7a being the second most important feature.

For example, take a look at this game #117 with Bill Webber from the semi-finals of the 1983 WC:

http://renju.se/rif/pente/cpente28.gif

here is always the risk, or course, that the opponent will be prepared themselves with innovations on their own play.

Which is what you seem to have done in GAME 4

After your 6) M13 (!) I already feel busted. If I play 6) ... L14, then you simply answer 7) O11 and Black has nothing. M9 for me at some point doesn't seem to have enough. Unless you see something for Black, I'm already crushed and resign.

A very nice move that seems to close the book on Black's 2nd move. Your move is a novelty, right?

Sheesh, then what does Black do for the second move after your 2) N12. I see that 2) ... M10 is one of the more popular tries, but I think that White wins immediately with 3) N13. Black seems to have nothing better there than 3) ... N10, but then 4) M12 (!) follow by 5) K12 leads to a snow-balling initiative.

It is a most exasperating experience these days to try and find anything for P2 anymore.

Your thoughts?,

Rollie

zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 10:19 PM

its only a exasperating experience for P2 in turn based.
turn based is like using training wheels in my opinion.

in live play i know many many moves to try for P1's N12.
and in rated live the data base is locked from their IP#.

P2 has high odds of winning one of the paths. i might try some on you in live timed so u see the difference. very few have memorized all moves. there are some obscure moves you did not consider yet.

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zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 10:59 PM

here P1 was not so lucky;
http://brainking.com/en/ArchivedGame?g=3672842&i=11

later i was inspired to try it too, then brf showed the new novelty;
http://brainking.com/en/ArchivedGame?g=3672849&i=9


later i then used brf's novelty to win;
but the game was deleted, for some reason when its best 2 out of 3 in a 2 game match the game 1 gets deleted, and only games 2 and 3 remain. i wasn't too happy to find this out just now.

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rollietesh

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 11:10 PM

Your reply to brf's novelty actually put up an admirable fight, though it was still not quite enough. The novelty is too strong and appears to refute P2's second move.

zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 11:17 PM

in the opening;
K10,N8,N12,M10,
the best 3rd for P1 is M12.
these moves are at brainking.com from the 2009 super pente tourney, and they are not in the data base yet.


2009 super pente tourney is here;
http://brainking.com/en/Tournaments?tri=359148#1

many tries of K10,N8,N12,M10,M12 were done here.
the very best one was done by nosovs vs brf, game is here;
http://brainking.com/en/ArchivedGame?g=3672895&i=8


i'll further point out that i got crushed rather hard in that tourney repeatedly by the opening of K10,N8,N11,P10

the reason is i had yet to discover the correct 3rd for P1, it wasn't until after my demise that nosovs explained to me the correct perfect play. P1's 3) L13 !!!!!!!!


Message was edited by: zoeyk at May 5, 2010 5:21 PM


Message was edited by: zoeyk at May 5, 2010 5:24 PM

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rollietesh

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Age: 51
Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 11:33 PM

The position after 3) M12 you apparently have analyzed to a win.

However, "best" move may apply equally as well to other moves, so I'm not sure if "best" is the right word. Perhaps "quickest" or "most forcing."

For example, the line I gave above appears short and forcing:

1) K10, N8
2) N12, M10
3) N13, N10
4) M12(!), L11
5) K12, O14*
6) K11, K9
7) L12, M12
8) N13*, M12
9) N14

And Black can resign. Does 3) M12 win quicker than that?

(BTW, I do not see my 4) M12 in the database.) In effect they are similar lines. M12 comes in my line one move later, but with a threat. Does your line win one move quicker?

Rollie

zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 5, 2010, 11:38 PM

hmmm lol i'll have to look at it


_________________________________

your right, but, this is based all on blacks 3rd move i had tried. based on limited move history its early to determine.


Message was edited by: zoeyk at May 5, 2010 5:43 PM


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rollietesh

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 6, 2010, 12:22 AM

Then again ...

1) K10, N8
2) N12, M10
3) N13, N11

... puts up some resistance.

Now I see why the direct 3) M12 could be "best".

rollietesh

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Age: 51
Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 6, 2010, 12:36 AM

Let's see what crushing novelty you have prepared for this:

GAME 6

1)K10,N10
2)L7, L8

zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 6, 2010, 1:59 AM

NOT a novelty ,... opening conversion...


K10,N10,L7,L8,J7


K10,N8,N11,L10,K12


see games for results;







and here would be P2's best attempt for a tactical position.












what about K9 for P2's 7th move here?













hehe, ok this line does get a bit lengthily, but P1 feels very comfortable knowing its rather controlled.




Message was edited by: zoeyk at May 5, 2010 8:10 PM


Message was edited by: zoeyk at May 5, 2010 8:24 PM

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zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 6, 2010, 2:34 AM

check these games out, i was rather happy with my results as P2.

i had jozso's P1 beat in 6 moves in the 2009 super pente tourney,...turn based with 2 days per move.
http://brainking.com/en/ArchivedGame?g=3672921&i=12


this was neat too



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zoeyk

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Re: The Rollie Tesh Analysis Thread.
Posted: May 6, 2010, 2:52 AM

in Game 1, you proposed O11 as your alt 9th move.
i counter with L12,... rollie to move

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Replies: 175   Views: 271,259   Pages: 12   [ Previous | 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 | Next ]
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